When Pat Robertson ran for the Republican party nomination for USA President he won one caucus state election. The year he ran Jessie Jackson (an ultra progressive candidate) ran for the Democratic party nomination for USA President and Jackson won multiple states.
Disillusioned JW
JoinedPosts by Disillusioned JW
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18
Pat Robertson makes one last ''doomsday prediction''
by RULES & REGULATIONS inpat roberston,92, comes out of his million dollar mansion ( which his loyal followers paid for ) to continue his doomsday prediction.
pat needs to make one last appearance to show his followers he was right all along.
after all his failed predictions on his ''700 club,'' pat needs to show his followers that this ''doomsday prediction'' is a bible prophecy.
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Disillusioned JW
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Are They Letting the Organization Go?
by pistolpete ininteresting idea by;.
fabian strategy warrior.
to many of you, this idea might seem absurd, but is it?.
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Disillusioned JW
I read the claim that there were numerous WT doctrinal changes made since the year 2013 but I am only aware of a few (or at most several) of them. I ask that someone post a long list of the changes.
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Are They Letting the Organization Go?
by pistolpete ininteresting idea by;.
fabian strategy warrior.
to many of you, this idea might seem absurd, but is it?.
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Disillusioned JW
Getting rid of types and antitypes might cause a problem for the religion in some ways, but types and antitypes is bad theology (and wrong application of bible prophecies), and outmoded thinking. For example, neither Jehovah God (nor any any pre-Christian humans attributed as writers for him) ever meant for apostate Jerusalem or apostate Israel to represent a future Christendom (or apostate Christianity). Likewise the writer (whether the human transcriber, Jesus, or even Jehovah) of the book of Revelation never meant for the two witnesses (mentioned in Revelation) to refer to 7 or 8 men at WT headquarters (nor the WT corporation, nor Russell's/Rutherford's Bible Student movement) of the 20th century CE.
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Jehovah's witnesses at polish border. Wtf
by usualusername1 insky news reporting ukrainian refugees coming into poland.
"jws are offering support".
🤦🏿.
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Disillusioned JW
Unlike in North Korea the JW men in the Ukraine can get a religious exemption (perhaps being required to do medical work during wartime or some other noncombat community service). Note that https://www.refworld.org/docid/57a188544.html (a website of the UN) says the following (the bold face emphasis is mine).
'2. Conscientious Objectors
Sources state that the Ukrainian military allows for alternative service for conscientious objectors (US 14 Oct. 2015, 5; UN Sept. 2015, para. 36; Equal Rights Trust Aug. 2015, 192) based on religious grounds (ibid.; UN Sept. 2015, para. 36). According to information posted on the website of the Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Article 35 of The Constitution of Ukraine states that
[n]o one shall be relieved of his or her duties before the State or refuse to perform the laws for reasons of religious beliefs. In the case that the performance of military duty is contrary to the religious beliefs of a citizen, the performance of this duty shall be replaced by alternative (non-military) service. (Ukraine [2015])
The 2004 summary version of the 1992 Law of Ukraine "'On Alternative (Non-Military) Service'," as found on the website of the Institute for Religious Freedom (IRF), a Kyiv-based human rights NGO that assists "in the realization of freedom of conscience, religion, beliefs and other related human rights…and dissemination of information on the status of the law and religious life" in Ukraine (IRF n.d.), states that
[c]itizens shall do alternative service on the enterprises which are in state or communal ownership or dominant part in the state fund of which is in the state or communal ownership. Activity of such enterprises shall be related to social protection of population, health protection, environmental protection, building, housing and communal services, and agriculture. Besides, alternative service may be conducted in medical attendance service in Red Cross organizations of Ukraine. Labour relations between the citizen who does military service and enterprise shall be maintained on the basis of written fixed-date labour agreement. (Ukraine 2004)
Further information on the details of alternative non-military service could not be found among the sources consulted by the Research Directorate within the time constraints of this Response.
According to a report by Equal Rights Trust[1], which was written in partnership with the LGBT Human Right Centre Nash Mir, the religious groups that are able to claim conscientious objector status, on the basis that their religious organisations do not allow their members to bear arms, are: Adventist Reform Church, Seventh Day Adventists, Evangelical Christians, Evangelical Christian-Baptists, the Slavic Church of the Holy Spirit (Pokutnyky), Jehovah's Witnesses, the Charismatic Christian Churches and the International Society for Krishna Consciousness (Equal Rights Trust Aug. 2015, 192). An excerpt from the forthcoming (2016) book Free Radicals: War Resisters in Prison, by CJ Hinke, as found on the website of World Beyond War, a "global nonviolent movement to end war and establish a just and sustainable peace" (World Beyond War n.d.b), similarly indicates that in Ukraine, those who are able to claim religious conscientious objector status are: Seventh Day Adventists, Baptists, Adventists-Reformists, Jehovah's Witnesses and Charismatic Christians (ibid. n.d.a).'
https://www.state.gov/reports/2020-report-on-international-religious-freedom/ukraine/ ("An official website of the United States Government") mentions legal cases involving JWs in Ukraine.
https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/by-region/ukraine/human-rights-conscientious-objectors/ has a news article which says the following (the bold face emphasis is mine). "Ukraine’s high court has affirmed that conscientious objectors have the right to alternative service even in times of civil unrest and war. This decision has broad implications for human rights, both in Ukraine and abroad.
... The courts of Ukraine have recognized that conscientious objection to military service is a fundamental human right that merits protection even during military mobilization. It is neither a selfish evasion of duty nor a threat to national interests and security. In affirming the rulings of the lower courts, the high court has upheld human rights for all Ukrainians. Ukraine has set an example for countries that punish conscientious objectors who refuse military service for reasons of conscience."
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Why the King of South (USA) is in the Northern Hemisphere?
by pistolpete inthere's been a lot of talk among jws, that this is it with russia (king of the north) pushing and shoving against the (king of the south usa).
but look at the world map below on the link, and notice that usa is in the northern hemisphere.. meaning the king of the south must be none other than -----------argentina .
that's so funny that jws still can't figure it out that they are being conned to the max.
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Disillusioned JW
Other than first king of the north and the first king of the south (according to WT interpretation and according to the interpretation of many Christian groups), I think it also pertains to the role the most recent kings take in relation to the prior two kings. I think it is role which primarily identifies them, not primarily which one is at the most northern latitude. For a WT explanation in regards to the communist block led by the Soviet Union (now identified as led by Russia and its allies) being the king of the north, see pages 270 and 275-278 in the WT 1999 book called Pay Attention to DANIEL'S PROPHECY (note that book was revised in 2006 but I don't have a copy of the revision and I haven't read the current online edition).
But note that most modern scholars (at least according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel%27s_final_vision ) say "... that the Daniel who appears as the hero of the Book of Daniel never existed ...".
If one accepts the WT's interpretation (at least that given in the first edition of the Daniel book) of the current kings of the north and the south (and of whom they currently say is the king of the north), then most likely according to that interpretation there will not be a nuclear war between Britain-USA and Russia (along with its allies). Why is that? Well if they mutually attacked each other with nuclear weapons then most likely neither of them would remain a world power and there would likely no longer be a king of the north and a king of the south (in the sense of the WT interpretation of the prophecy in Daniel) - not even later replacement kings for them. But page 285 (along with page 179) of the WT's book on Daniel says that neither of the two kings comes to its end by the hands of the other, but that instead the king of the south is destroyed by God's Kingdom and that at the battle of Armageddon all earthly kings at time will be removed by God's kingdom.
Interestingly page 278 of the WT's Daniel book in paragraph 17 says the following. "In modern times [Edom, Moab, and Ammon] represent nations and organizations that the king of the north targeted but was unable to bring under his influence." Could that also prove to be the case with Russia's attack on Ukraine? Very recent reports says that Russian is having a hard time in quickly defeating Ukraine, and the reports say many nations are condemning Russians war actions against the Ukraine. Furthermore Germany and the USA announced it will send weapons to the Ukraine, the EU said it will pay for weapons that will go to Ukraine, nations are financially cutting off Russian banks from SWIFT, and England along with the EU are cutting off commercial flights to their lands from Russia. Furthermore, according to Fox News "Ukrainian military official releases video showing what appears to be Russian missile system being destroyed by a drone" (but I don't yet know if that claim is accurate).
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Jehovah's witnesses at polish border. Wtf
by usualusername1 insky news reporting ukrainian refugees coming into poland.
"jws are offering support".
🤦🏿.
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Disillusioned JW
I read (in regards to Ukraine) that is a drafting/conscripting reservists of men aged 18 - 60. I'm not sure that means the men were drafted to enter the reserves (see the article below which gives a clue). Maybe it only means that those men already in the reserves have been drafted/conscripted into service.
Furthermore, an article from last December says the following (at https://www.military.com/daily-news/2021/12/27/ukraine-requires-women-register-military-conscription-russia-threat-looms.html ).
'According to an updated regulation that went into effect Friday, Dec. 17, women between 18 and 60 who are "fit for military service" and work in a broad range of professions are required to register with Ukraine's armed forces. In the event of a major war, this expanded reserve of women can be mobilized as part of the national reserve to serve in a broad range of military specialties.
"This is not about conscription after reaching some age, as it is for men. It is about conscription in the wartime. And considering more than 122,000 Russian troops are at our borders, the decision seems logical, timely, and sensible," said Oleksandra Ustinova, 36, a member of Ukraine's national parliament, the Verkhovna Rada.'
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How the Good work of Russell became the curse of the Watchtower today
by Terry inthe greatest benefit to come from jehovah's witnesses was the introduction of honest investigation into the.
claims of christianity based on the bible.. exposing error was the gimmick.. replacing doctrine or ritual with door to door activity was the greatest failure to follow truth where it leads.. .
mainstream religion in pastor russell's day was set in stone.
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Disillusioned JW
Update: I notice that according to the above mentioned Wikipedia article France did have a powerful radical and socialist party at one time. The article says the following about that. "Until World War II, Radicals were a strong political force in France, embodied by the Republican, Radical and Radical-Socialist Party which was the most important party of the Third Republic."
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How the Good work of Russell became the curse of the Watchtower today
by Terry inthe greatest benefit to come from jehovah's witnesses was the introduction of honest investigation into the.
claims of christianity based on the bible.. exposing error was the gimmick.. replacing doctrine or ritual with door to door activity was the greatest failure to follow truth where it leads.. .
mainstream religion in pastor russell's day was set in stone.
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Disillusioned JW
Correction: In my prior post where I said "... on pages 61 - 62 ..." I should have said "... on pages 62 - 63 ...".
The writer of page 63 of the Our Incoming WORLD GOVERNMENT ~ God's Kingdom seems to be confused (or intentionally misleading) as to the meaning of the word "democratic". I say that because right after the sentence of "The making of governments democratic by revolutions or otherwise has led on to radical proletarian forms of government" on page 63 the writer says the following.
"And these latter stand in an uncompromising opposition to the ironlike Seventh World Power, the Anglo-American Dual World Power. Till now the two forms of rulership have managed to live alongside each other, but there has been no real marriage between them. The radical, proletarian governments and blocs may appear to be very strong and seemingly outmaneuvering the Anglo-American World Power in strength." The writer thus seems to be writing about the then communist block of countries, but the governments of those countries (though coming about by by violent revolution by the common people along with a leader of theirs) are not democratic. It should also be noted that shortly after the USA created their republic by having a violent revolution against Britain, France created their republic by having an even more violent revolution. That revolution largely came from the common people and though the revolution soon led to a reign of terror, its nation eventually became a stable democratic republic It did not become communist. During World War II the USA became an ally of it. Wikipedia says the following about it at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France . "France is representative democracy organised as a unitary, semi-presidential republic.[133] As one of the earliest republics of the modern world, democratic traditions and values are deeply rooted in French culture, identity and politics.[134] "
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How the Good work of Russell became the curse of the Watchtower today
by Terry inthe greatest benefit to come from jehovah's witnesses was the introduction of honest investigation into the.
claims of christianity based on the bible.. exposing error was the gimmick.. replacing doctrine or ritual with door to door activity was the greatest failure to follow truth where it leads.. .
mainstream religion in pastor russell's day was set in stone.
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Disillusioned JW
Terry, another excellent point you made is the following you said as the source of authority that the governing body relies upon.
"IT ALL RESTS MERELY ON THEIR OWN ASSERTIONS.
Mark this one fact and it all falls into place:
The fragility of the bible as a source authority must NEVER be allowed to be discussed!
Why?
It is the bundling of their own peculiar interpretions (under the guise of "mouthpiece") with BIBLE that is the engine that drives the Governing Body's authority.
If people ever really knew facts about the errancy of the Bible and started investigating on their on the house of cards would quickly tumble.
THE BIBLE MUST BE PROPPED UP NO MATTER WHAT!
The Governing Body presents itself as the champion of God's Word. In reality, they are the champions of their own crazy thinking."
In short (and I paraphrase), you correctly said that for the WT and its governing body (whom they themselves now say is exclusively the faithful and discreet slave) that "THE BIBLE MUST BE PROPPED UP NO MATTER WHAT!" That is why the WT literature has so often (going at least as far back as a volume of Russell's Studies in the Scriptures) condemned atheism and the theory of biological evolution. It even claimed and continues to claim that those ideas are doctrines of Satan the Devil. [For example see the following: The box on the bottom of page 95 of the 1981 WT book called "Let your Kingdom come".] It is like I said in a post about six days ago - "The Bible is an enabler for the WT religion!"
Likewise, the WT and the governing body need their readers and followers to believe in the existence of a literal Satan the Devil. That is so that the WT and the governing body can attribute ideas they dislike to Satan the Devil (and/or his demons) and thus scare away people from investigating those ideas with an open mind. Besides evolution and atheism, those ideas include higher criticism of the Bible, the idea that the best governments are those who derive their authority bottom up from the people (even the common people) instead of top down from God (allegedly) through a theocracy, and various other ideas which are taught in various colleges, and ideas taught by ex-JWs who criticize the WT.
For example notice how the WT conveys a a very negative disparaging idea of governments which derive their authority (or some of it) from the common people. [This is in contrast to the idea of the authoritarian divine rule of kings (and of other monarchs).] It is stated on pages 61 - 62 of the 1977 WT book called Our Incoming WORLD GOVERNMENT ~ God's Kingdom. There it says the following.
'Despite the fragile nature of "clay" of which the "offspring of mankind" are made, the trend of human rulership in these last decades of its existence has been in which direction? No, not to God the Creator of the animated "clay," but to the creatures of clay, to the common people, the "proletariat" as the ancient Romans called the lowest or poorest class of people who contributed nothing but offspring (proles) to the political State. The old traditional rulership has been obliged to listen more and more to the clamor of the common people for a share in governments over them.
56 However, there can be no marriage between the old aristocratic, authoritarian style of government and the common people who favor radical, thoroughgoing changes in government. No more so than there can be an amalgamation of iron with clay! The making of governments democratic by revolutions or otherwise has led on to radical proletarian forms of government.'
The book classifies the "American Republic, the United States of America" as an authoritarian government [and the book on pages 60-61 calls "the Anglo-American World Power ... the greatest world power of them all from a human standpoint."] That government (the U.S.A) came into existence as a democratic republic by a violent revolution (against Britain, a monarchy then ruled by a king), and in one of its founding documents it claims that its government derives its authority from the people, yet as quoted above the book disparages governments which come into existence that way! The book is trying to have it both ways and in so doing it contradicts itself.
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How the Good work of Russell became the curse of the Watchtower today
by Terry inthe greatest benefit to come from jehovah's witnesses was the introduction of honest investigation into the.
claims of christianity based on the bible.. exposing error was the gimmick.. replacing doctrine or ritual with door to door activity was the greatest failure to follow truth where it leads.. .
mainstream religion in pastor russell's day was set in stone.
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Disillusioned JW
Hi Terry. Today I am reading your posts of this 11-year old topic (which I found by doing a search on certain words) and I am impressed by what you wrote in this topic. I am especially impressed by your first post of this topic. You make an excellent point of saying that the WT's (and governing body's) doctrine of the faithful and discreet slave (at least of the core element of it) can be traced to an idea of Maria Russell (and to promotion of that idea by her). [Or, perhaps others associated with the Watchtower thought it up first, but she heavily promoted it, at least according the Proclaimer's book (If I recall correctly what it said about it).]